Master SuperMaster says: "A true Dom can bring any submissive to heel."
This is rubbish. Even if it should be true as a principle, it's not fun to actually play out in SL.
As a Dom, I strongly prefer training willing submissives over battling bratty ones. This is true for the player and the character. Why?
My time is valuable. In SL, there are many subs and few Doms. Any time and attention I give one sub takes away from another. It's very easy to reward negative attention-seeking behavior, and thus reinforce it. In a public encounter involving several subs, I would rather reward the sub who seems eager to please, especially if she is making an effort to write vivid, distinct posts.
I enjoy sensuality, sexuality, and Dominance. I don't enjoy disciplining children. In my 1st life, I'm a parent, and I've taught high school. I already get my share of defiant, adolescent nonsense. I come to SL for something else.
Many so-called submissives seem to enjoy challenging Doms in public. There is frequently a subtext of, "Make me respect you." I've talked with subs about this OOC, and this subtext may be a deliberate or unconscious expression of the frustration that a Dom is going to focus more on one sub than another. I'm curious what others think.
Don't get me wrong. I love a good struggle of will and strength. If a sub challenges me with an energetic, vivid post, I can see that her respect and yielding is worth fighting for. But one-line cheap shots? Parting snipes? "mutters under her breath"?
"You can't Dom me." "Probably not. Why would I want to?"
I'm not here to entertain you. I'm here to co-construct a mutually pleasurable experience. If you want to tell a story in which you're a defiant brat, I respect your tastes and goals, but you'll have to find a different collaborator.
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EXACTLY ... last night, for example, I was setting up a rp that you participated in that was an example of this in action.
ReplyDeleteUnder everything, Puyin(IC) is willing, intelligent, and very submissive. When comfortable, she's not really outgoing, but is easily drawn into conversation and role play. Her "default", however, is almost painful shyness.
Reading the Rules of Master Sin in the newspaper, her initial reaction was outrage at an affront to la Presidente and she was acting out that outrage a bit.
I was talking rebelliously, but not rebelling, the result of confusion in loyalties and not thinking through all the implications of possible responses to the conundrum of conflicting loyalties. Ultimately, you took me in hand and showed me the error of my ways and the disconnect with my underlying core values.
The rp was fun because it involved change in thought and action through the application of gentle but firm restraint (your hand in my hair), persuasive demeanor (your voice), and your words.
I have heard the "you cant dom me" response as least a few times. Makes one wonder if that is a challenge or a complaint. Not everyone knows how to submit as not everyone knows how to be a dominant. Some dominants are just plain bullies or worse. Unfortunately some submissives think being a sub is submitting to abuse.
ReplyDeleteBDSM is either fun or a felony depending on what happens and how it is takin by both sides of the play. Play should always be safe and sane as well as mutually enjoyed.
From the submissive's point of view they would want to be dominated so it makes no sense to argue with the dominant over ability to dominate. In fact, as a submissive, i find myself assisting dominants who might be inexperienced.
Who ever says "you cant dom me" is absolutely right and needs to either find another Dom to play with or consider another form of play.
In the case of my character, moose, in dark den however there is no clear cut Dom/sub category she fits in.
Moose is a large, uneducated, woman who has had a hard life and is somewhat stubborn but also kind and somewhat timid when confronted unless she is protecting something she cares about. It would not be accurate to assume moose is a submissive as defined in the D/s lifestyle. With moose what you see is what you get. She calls it like she sees it. You can choose interact with her or not.
All that said, it is important to understand from the start who you are playing with and what the expectations are. Don't be afraid of contacting the other side by ((double quotes)) or directly in im if the play is going in a direction you dont like. That goes for the Dom or sub or who ever. It is no fun playing with partner who is not enjoying the interaction. It is even less fun to be playing with a partner when you are not enjoying it.
Moose said it perfectly. Who ever says "you cant dom me" is absolutely right and needs to either find another Dom to play with or consider another form of play.
ReplyDeleteWe inspectors need to identify more of the following:
**those Doms who come off as abusive but are educable -- and educate them or refer them for some coaching
**those Doms who come off as weak but are educable -- and educate them or refer them to some coaching
**those subs who come off as belligerent or bellicose but are educable -- and educate them or refer them to some coaching
**all who are not educable -- and not move them forward.
Which brings me to another possible issue -- should there be an "inspectors" group so that inspectors can pass along information about people they've failed to pass for one reason or another?
Now, I think our gardener or la Presidente sort of field all these and maybe we could solve some of our own issues through sharing more widely (but include the gardener and la Presidente in the loop).
Moose sorts it this way.
ReplyDelete1. Those who know what they are doing and help others enjoy it as well.
2. Those who have no clue what they are doing but want to learn and are willing to listen.
3. Those who have no clue what they are doing and will not listen because they think they are doing it right and everyone else is wrong.
We dont need to help group one and there is no helping those in group 3 so we just gotta help those in group 2. :)
I do believe I am going to enjoy following this blog..I have encountered such and will let it go. However I have found myself questioning if I should have and now I realize I can without worry.
ReplyDeleteCheers.
I have no problems with being selective over those you indulge, however I think you caught one of the greater problems on the DD ".. there are many subs and few Doms."
ReplyDeletePersonally I spend around 10 to 15 hours each week guiding people round totally rp'ing it. I probably take more time than most to take them through the setting, provide general rp practice and and let them know about the roles pointing out that the Den has a strong emphasis on the Elite and Sister roles (but there other roles with differing emphasis on the levels of D/S please remember).
Of the few girls that return I continue to try and guide them, often making good friends but find my heart broken time after time as they drift away. Why do they drift away? Lack of available males is the problem. If you look around the Den, at most there are about 2 or 3 free males even at peak times. Each of these continues to choose those that appear to be the most submissive, leaving the rest, day after day, week after week wondering why they came in the 1st place. Are they submissive? Yes. Do they need coaching? Yes. I even perform lesbian scenes or get them invited into my own rare more intimate scenes with males where I can to help coach them. Even though neither is a personal preference I accept performing such rp for a purpose, not just living out my own personal fantasy.
Recently I watched an incident where one girl performed an apparently brattish act.. was she acting like a brat? No, in fact desperation of having no luck after being here for almost 3 weeks caused her to seek attention in that way, though it still ended in rejection. The incident by the way caused much amusement to others including two girls I was guiding round at the time. However both were disappointed with the final reaction and neither have returned since, despite both pointedly thanking me for for their tour.
**SIGH**
ReplyDeleteTami is exactly right, I'm afraid. My experiences with guiding visitors parallels hers, and the my frequency of interaction with males is eerily parallel to hers.
I offer the following statistics from 6+ weeks at the Den as proof.
**I came to DD pregnant, but have gone through 2 cycles thereafter with no pregnancy.
**DD is a kidnap sim, but I am yet to be kidnapped.
**DD is a rape/forced sex sim, yet I have been forced twice in 6 weeks, both times in the past week by the same Master.
**Roleplayed sex I did have during my time here was consensual, and initiated by me as often as not.
One answer is the recruitment of new males. Another may be to wear out the current males until they are but shadows of themselves.
*smiles as you all discuss the issues she has been battling forever*
ReplyDeleteAs far as subs who like to challenge and make trouble, I am not one of those. I understand it is a path to submission to some...that they must feel themselves outmatched and only then can they feel good about submitting. It's not wrong, it's not a bad thing. It is a style of submission, just as an easier, gentler submission is. Some Doms enjoy it, others do not. In my time as a slave trainer I found it exhausting, a nuisance, and something that took my time away from the patient, gentle slaves who were also under my care.
I have found that the challenging subs tend to be challenging always. If the thrills and power trips stop...so does their attention, and they are off again, to another sim, another Master, etc.
As far as the lack of males I have not yet found where they are hiding out. However it seems to me that this scenario is played out in the vast majority of SL that I have encountered. Always loads of slaves and never enough males. I do not think this is a Dark Den specific problem, and the resulting lack of RP can be directly linked to it.
on and non-serious note, you entertain anyways. Very good rp and such. Blog gives good insight too. I find girls like that are just not worth giving a shit. I know i can be a hassle but its cause i've met so many who claim master and aren't. :: shrugs :: Yes I challenge them in my own way....but they usually respond with fear. My response to that is "wtf....oh hell...i'm going home." :: goes back to hiding out ::
ReplyDeleteI'll echo Ava's comments ... in the Gor sims, where there are a few more men, there are even fewer who really want (and are able) to rp.
ReplyDeleteThe preference is more for playing with their swords ...
Ahem.... which sword is that?
ReplyDeleteAhem.... which sword is that?
ReplyDeleteUsually just about any sword that is "ready to hand."
As Kandr's beloved primary, it is one of my duties to point out the opposing argument. While I agree that MasterSuperMaster is an ass - there is something about chemistry and personalities that make some Masters/submissives incompatible - I don't agree that a submissive should not challenge a supposed 'Master' to see if he's the 'Real Deal', or just someone out to prey on submissives. A savvy submissive learns a lot from the response to the first gentle challenge she throws out - and every Master should be willing to earn respect in the eyes of the woman he is seducing into Domination.
ReplyDeleteMasterSuperMaster would bludgeon the creature, or throw a tantrum. I prefer the Masters who revert to using my sensuality against me, and make me *want* to submit. Or the ones who use logic as a tool, and engage my mind. It is entirely acceptable to use physical methods, as long as the undertone is absolute self-control. An out of control Dom is perhaps one of the things nightmares are made of...
Just my thoughts... a challenge, in itself, may not be disrespectful. It may simply be a dropping of the handkerchief... an invitation to dance.
Brattiness for the sake of being a brat, is a different story all together.